I picked it up.   Just can't resist.

Originally Posted By Johnnie (16 FEB 2012 3:09pm)

the Jutland game itself is not suited, in my opinion, for simulating anything approaching a fleet size action.  With S&I you can observe and fight a fleet as well as a small squadron.

 

Thats interesting to hear.  Ive avoided SES for other reasons, but I would think a simulation should be able to simulate the battle that its named after.

S&I is a fun game though, glad I bought it.

Originally Posted By BlondKnight (16 FEB 2012 8:16pm)

Originally Posted By Johnnie (16 FEB 2012 3:09pm)

the Jutland game itself is not suited, in my opinion, for simulating anything approaching a fleet size action.  With S&I you can observe and fight a fleet as well as a small squadron.

 

 

Thats interesting to hear.  Ive avoided SES for other reasons, but I would think a simulation should be able to simulate the battle that its named after.

 

S&I is a fun game though, glad I bought it.

The interface is a pain. 

The only other big complaint I've had about SES mechanics, other than the clunky interface (a regular 3D wargame problem), is that the optional British damage crits seem a bit high.  Ultimately that value will be speculative due to a comparatively small number of such critical explosions to put a definite percentage rate on it.  I lean on a smaller side than portrayed.  Unfortunately it's either an on or off situation there.

But overall it's a great game and even has a huge campaign layer to boot.  High price and the DRM was the big downside to it.  I choked it down because.. hell, it's  WWI and naval combat.

Originally Posted By Nefaro (16 FEB 2012 8:24pm)

 

 

The interface is a pain. 

 

The only other big complaint I've had about SES mechanics, other than the clunky interface (a regular 3D wargame problem), is that the optional British damage crits seem a bit high.  Ultimately that value will be speculative due to a comparatively small number of such critical explosions to put a definite percentage rate on it.  I lean on a smaller side than portrayed.  Unfortunately it's either an on or off situation there.

 

But overall it's a great game and even has a huge campaign layer to boot.  High price and the DRM was the big downside to it.  I choked it down because.. hell, it's  WWI and naval combat.

 

 

You're talking about SES's Jutland, right? If so, I agree.

What do you think of SAI so far? Glad you pulled the trigger.

Originally Posted By Slick Wilhelm (16 FEB 2012 9:19pm)

 

 

You're talking about SES's Jutland, right? If so, I agree.

 

What do you think of SAI so far? Glad you pulled the trigger.

 

 

Yes, my small complaints were about Jutland.  SAI also reminded me of another complaint in SES Jutland - how easily the destroyers are slaughtered by larger ship's gunfire.  There are noticeable penalties in SAI that make their lifespan more than five minutes when anywhere within gun range of enemy vessels.  The SAI dev(s) have done a very nice job with the gunnery stuff.

I played Elli 1912 (first on the list) and knocked the snot out of the Turkish AI.  It doesn't seem to do well near a coastline, as the AI kept running up to, and along, the coast while I pinned them at the ranges I was comfortable with.  Did that twice up and down part of the Turkish coast and my superior fire control on my armored cruiser was telling.  I don't think it would've been as easy if the AI fleet wasn't pinned against the coast for so long. 

Still, it was very enjoyable and the mechanics of it just feel quite right. 

I've not even read the manual yet, just fired that one up for a quick look and ended up playing it to the end.    I desperately need to look up the hot-keys, especially for the zoom-out buttons.  I found myself zooming in & out a lot if only to click directly on each ship to bring up it's info screen as opposed to using the extra button clicks while going through the squadron window.

The other thing that SES doesn't and SaI has is fog of war. 

Originally Posted By Nefaro (16 FEB 2012 11:20pm)

I desperately need to look up the hot-keys, especially for the zoom-out buttons.  I found myself zooming in & out a lot if only to click directly on each ship to bring up it's info screen as opposed to using the extra button clicks while going through the squadron window.

 

The current zoom keys are page up/down, and +/-.

In the next build, Fredrik is going to add z/x as zoom keys and WASD keys to scroll the map, all based on my whining from having to cross my hands over to zoom on my laptop. 

Gotta love a developer like Fredrik that actually gives a damn about his customers. He's great! 

Using the mousewheel to zoom makes things exciting real fast.

Originally Posted By BlondKnight (17 FEB 2012 7:10am)

Using the mousewheel to zoom makes things exciting real fast.

You must've mapped zoom to your mousewheel via the drivers, eh? Because I know that mouse wheel zoom is not natively supported in the game(yet). 

No, Im just used to the mousewheel controlling the zoom function that I gave it a try.  (heaven forbid I should read the manual)

The result was similar to Dark Helmets reaction to going to "Ludicrus speed"

Originally Posted By Chelco (17 FEB 2012 5:20am)

The other thing that SES doesn't and SaI has is fog of war. 

 

 

After scanning some of the manual, I've also been impressed with some small things in SAI regarding this FOW.  Such as fake sightings and such (including fake sub sightings, which happened fairly regularly back then & often altered plans).  Great touch. 

Originally Posted By Slick Wilhelm (17 FEB 2012 7:00am)

 

 

The current zoom keys are page up/down, and +/-.

 

In the next build, Fredrik is going to add z/x as zoom keys and WASD keys to scroll the map, all based on my whining from having to cross my hands over to zoom on my laptop. 

 

Gotta love a developer like Fredrik that actually gives a damn about his customers. He's great! 

 

 

Excellent news on the WASD map movement, although the rt-click & hold isn't too bad for me atm.

And thank you for the Zoom hotkey info.  I didn't see any hotkeys listed in the manual.  I hope there are more than just the two basic zoom ones (or more on the way).

EDIT:  Has anyone else had problems with their squadron's ordered speed returning to maximum every turn or two?  I can't get them to go slower than their max speed!

Originally Posted By Nefaro (17 FEB 2012 7:31am)
 

 

EDIT:  Has anyone else had problems with their squadron's ordered speed returning to maximum every turn or two?  I can't get them to go slower than their max speed! 

 

Perhaps they've reverted to AI control? What level are you playing at? 

If their little flag has changed from a square to a triangle, then they're under AI control. 

Originally Posted By BlondKnight (17 FEB 2012 7:18am)

No, Im just used to the mousewheel controlling the zoom function that I gave it a try.  (heaven forbid I should read the manual)

 

The result was similar to Dark Helmets reaction to going to "Ludicrus speed"

Oh yes, I know what you mean. Currently, the mouse wheel seems to be mapped to whatever is "active" in the game window, which is often the game speed drop down window. 

I hit ludicrous speed myself many times when I first started playing, until I trained myself to not use the mouse wheel. Hopefully Fredrik will add configurable mouse wheel controls at some point. 

Originally Posted By Slick Wilhelm (17 FEB 2012 7:56am)

Originally Posted By Nefaro (17 FEB 2012 7:31am)
 

 

EDIT:  Has anyone else had problems with their squadron's ordered speed returning to maximum every turn or two?  I can't get them to go slower than their max speed! 

 

 

Perhaps they've reverted to AI control? What level are you playing at? 

 

If their little flag has changed from a square to a triangle, then they're under AI control. 

 

 

Nope, they're under my control.  I've started a topic on it, over on the NWS forum, and given a heads-up.  Unlike some people, I installed the game & then the 1.01 update before playing so perhaps that install order changed something..

Also:  Have you figured out how to detach a damaged ship from it's division?  I've not been able to find the option and when the lead ship gets heavily damaged, and slows a good deal, I'd like to break it off from the group and send it out of the way.

Originally Posted By Nefaro (17 FEB 2012 8:20am)

 

Also:  Have you figured out how to detach a damaged ship from it's division?  I've not been able to find the option and when the lead ship gets heavily damaged, and slows a good deal, I'd like to break it off from the group and send it out of the way.

 

 

Here's a direct quote from Frederik concerning the potential of adding a detach ship button:

I am considering that one, they should detach automatically in most cases though, depending on damage level.

I won my first battle last pm as Blucher vs Rurik. I'm hooked.

Originally Posted By Slick Wilhelm (17 FEB 2012 8:34am)

Originally Posted By Nefaro (17 FEB 2012 8:20am)

 

Also:  Have you figured out how to detach a damaged ship from it's division?  I've not been able to find the option and when the lead ship gets heavily damaged, and slows a good deal, I'd like to break it off from the group and send it out of the way.

 

 

 

Here's a direct quote from Frederik concerning the potential of adding a detach ship button:

 

I am considering that one, they should detach automatically in most cases though, depending on damage level.

 

 

Yes, they will detach automatically.  More specifically, it will give you a pop-up saying that the damaged ship cannot keep up enough speed to stay with the division, and asks if you want to detach it.  Works okay as it is, I just worry about my divisions getting jammed up, and slowed down, when the lead ship is slowed up a fair amount.   So I have a tendency to wanna detach a speed-restricted vessel a bit earlier than the program does by default.

As for the speed being repeatedly reset to max, I found the issue.  I was using the spacebar to advance one minute at a time, and it was resetting ordered speed to max on the 2nd turn after speed change.  I'll use the interface buttons until that 1min turn hotkey gets fixed.  I'm not terribly crazy about letting the game run straight through as I micromanage my headings a lot.

Fun game.  It's got the right mix of features yet keeps the battles very manageable no matter their size.

Do not use the wheel on your mouse.. it will pick up on any "highlighted" function on the screen. The engine we use for SAI does not use the wheel itself, Windows however does and notices where the "highlighted" function is set in drop down tabs. 

Thanks.

Originally Posted By Warship NWS (17 FEB 2012 2:32pm)

Do not use the wheel on your mouse.. it will pick up on any "highlighted" function on the screen. The engine we use for SAI does not use the wheel itself, Windows however does and notices where the "highlighted" function is set in drop down tabs. 

 

Thanks.

If you want to use the mouse wheel, you need to select the speed with a left click, and then the mouse wheel function will work.

The only time i use this is at the very beginning of the game, as I go searching for the enemy fleet.

Funny story...I started a generated scenario, random everything. I had two CL's, and the enemy force? FIVE battleships, and a crap load of destroyers.

I had 19000 points, the AI had 180K. Never seen a 9:1 ratio before!!! I was shooting at the destroyers, and a whole frigging LINE of BB's came into the picture. I thought at first that they were mis-identified, but even five lighter ships was too much! I turned tail, went to ludicrous speed, and boogied out of there!

Originally Posted By DennisS (17 FEB 2012 3:51pm)

 

 

Funny story...I started a generated scenario, random everything. I had two CL's, and the enemy force? FIVE battleships, and a crap load of destroyers.

 

I had 19000 points, the AI had 180K. Never seen a 9:1 ratio before!!! I was shooting at the destroyers, and a whole frigging LINE of BB's came into the picture. I thought at first that they were mis-identified, but even five lighter ships was too much! I turned tail, went to ludicrous speed, and boogied out of there!

Read the random battle settings part in the manual.  There's one that can specifically unbalance it when set to 'random'.  You must've cranked them all up to random? 

On another note.. the AI certainly pushes it to ludicrous speed and GTFOs when it see that it has inflicted more damage on you (notably engine hits->speed loss for you) than vice versa, in the historical scenarios.  Looks to play it quite conservatively, but I guess a win is a win.  I hope it presses the advantage and goes for bigger wins in some situations, however.

Just ordered the game and downloaded, but can't install it as it's asking for a registration number I don't have.  Anyone else have that problem?

As noted on our store - the serial codes are emailed within 1 business day, yours is now emailed.

Thanks.

OK, thanks Chris.  I must have missed that about you emailing the code later.  Matrix has me spoiled with sending the code immediately I guess.  Thanks again for your support.

Originally Posted By Nefaro (17 FEB 2012 5:20pm)

Originally Posted By DennisS (17 FEB 2012 3:51pm)

 

 

Funny story...I started a generated scenario, random everything. I had two CL's, and the enemy force? FIVE battleships, and a crap load of destroyers.

 

I had 19000 points, the AI had 180K. Never seen a 9:1 ratio before!!! I was shooting at the destroyers, and a whole frigging LINE of BB's came into the picture. I thought at first that they were mis-identified, but even five lighter ships was too much! I turned tail, went to ludicrous speed, and boogied out of there!

 

Read the random battle settings part in the manual.  There's one that can specifically unbalance it when set to 'random'.  You must've cranked them all up to random? 

 

On another note.. the AI certainly pushes it to ludicrous speed and GTFOs when it see that it has inflicted more damage on you (notably engine hits->speed loss for you) than vice versa, in the historical scenarios.  Looks to play it quite conservatively, but I guess a win is a win.  I hope it presses the advantage and goes for bigger wins in some situations, however.

 

 

Yep. All random. I LIKE this. All I know is what country I am playing. I must say it did make for an oh s*** moment when the division of the big boys showed up. I didn't know a light cruiser could turn that fast! RETREAT!!!!!!!