Rise of Flight DRM Bashing Thread

Dsimp


My concern is with their DRM.  It has toconnect to their server the start and finish of each mission even insp.  They are  a new company and if they dont make it you will haveanother coaster.

If this is true about their DRM, then screw these guys and the DR1 they rode in on!

I'm very, very disappointed.  I just happened to come across the preview of this sim over at simhq two days ago, and I was getting all fired up on it.  But there is no way.  NO WAY.  NOOOO  WAAAAYYY.  That I am going to buy a sim that has to do its little drm check thingy every time I want to fly a mission (or twice if this is to be believed).

Seriously now.  There are so many workable DRM schemes out there.  Have I mentioned the excellent Matrixgames DRM scheme lately? 

I'm not even addressing the two available planes with more payware add-ons later.  I'm not even going there because that's that and I can't say for SURE that that in and of itself would have prevented my purchase. 

I can't forgive the DRM. 

I have never said this about a company before.  But, if this DRM scheme is true, then I hope this company fails.  I hope they fail and it serves notice to these clowns that this sort of stuff will not stand.

Thank you for your kind consideration, and I'm sorry to all of you that will have a drink coaster after this company fails.

Your flight-sim junkie/anti-DRM ranter.
Toonces

Man, I don't mind DRM once in a while - but to check ingame twice when you want to do the most basic of actions - that seems excessive.

Although, tbh, this smacks of paranoid hearsay more than reality. I would check this rumor over with a fine toothed comb.

SoM

Son_of_Montfort

Pick up some Latin, Gus, and you can get a free ride on the crazy train if you keep hanging with Son_of_Montfort.
-- LongBlade

The very first sentence in the description at gogamer, in red letters, is "internet connection required".

In addition, in the system requirements section, it says "internet connection required".

These clowns can kiss it.  I will not be taken advantage of like this!  I don't care how crappy the flightsim market is now.  This will not stand!

Psst...Over Flanders Fields is DRM-free!

Just remember kids, when you need something wholesome and innocent like Sesame Street twisted into something sick and perverted - I'm just a phone call away.

-HR

Although, tbh, this smacks of paranoid hearsay more than reality. I would check this rumor over with a fine toothed comb.

http://riseofflight.com/Blogs/March-2009/Online!!!-WTF---.aspx

* just a small notice for everyone with traffic or internet connectionproblem. For "career mode" or "singleplayer mode" you will only needconnection to start up or end up your mission (for your statistics).The rest of the time basically you don't have to be connected to theinternet. 3-4 hours play traffic will equal to one downloaded page onour blog. In "multiplayer mode" you should be connected to the internetat all time.

I have been looking forward to this sim along time and was ready to do a system upgrade so I could run it.  But when this came up put a end to it.

I have never said this about a company before.  But, if this DRM schemeis true, then I hope this company fails.  I hope they fail and itserves notice to these clowns that this sort of stuff will not stand.

Thank you.   I have thought this but never said it out loud.

"Old_Timer"

At least you get some benefit for having to maintain an internet connection before and after a flight - specifically that it tracks your statistics and allows those stats to be compared to the whole.   I realize for some of you people this won't matter, but at least there is something there besides just a DRM check.

I don't know if the impetus behind this was in a DRM centric way of thinking (and the stat tracking portion being a cover), or if it was a legit proper line of thinking (hey it'd be cool if the game automatically tracked all of your flight stats every time).

I bet it monitors a lot more than that.

-if you buy games off Steam what logic does one use to complain about this? By supporting the behavior you only encourage more of the same.

The comical side of this is "DRM FREE" is becoming the new fad in advertising- ironically by companies who were the worse offenders. As an example the new CivIV complete has a star display taking up 1/3 of it's ad space proclaiming "DRM FREE" yet they also boast the longest threads on thier forums "Can't pay Civ because of SecuROM." Heck I still have Civ III- using it as a coffee coaster- and the decade long list of emails to both companies and several computer builds later and I still can't get the game to run.

One thing I don't have is a refund...but I got a memory at least partially operating and the emails to remind me so I take these ads and place them in the same catagory as OJ protraying he's still looking for his wife's murderer. Once you rep is tarnished...it's tarnished. You can't repent. Your on the scum list.
 

Dude, I hear you.

It pains me daily to not be able to play Total War Empires.  I'm just shy of Jarhead on the Total War fanboy scale, but I WILL NOT BE FORCED TO GO ONTO THE INTERNET TO PLAY GAMES OFFLINE!    

YES, I'M SPEAKING TO YOU TOO, DISTANT GUNS AND JUTLAND.

I sent an email off today to the devs about the game in general.  As much interest as there is in it, I'd like to get more info.  Clearly some folks have concerns about the DRM, but there's a lot of interest in the title in general.  Hopefully we'll get some answers soon.

Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex... It takes a touch of genius - and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction.     - Albert Einstein

Gusington


Psst...Over Flanders Fields is DRM-free!

And it's one heck of a great WWI flight sim as well.

^Well yeah there's that too :)

Just remember kids, when you need something wholesome and innocent like Sesame Street twisted into something sick and perverted - I'm just a phone call away.

-HR

@toonces...I feel your pain and echo pretty much everything you said on this thread!

I feel the same way about having to be online for playing any pc game solo. I have missed out on several cool looking games (DoW 2, TW:E, Jutland, Distant guns, etc.) due to this DRM thing. I won't do it, and like too, I refuse to do it!

I guess one way to look at it...not buying DRM "wielding" games makes this recession a little easier on the bank account...although, sadly so...

Maybe we should all E&E to the mountains and start an anti-DRM revolution. What say ye? Are you with me lads?!!

I'm rapidly progressing to the "too drunk to post" criteria- my own little rule after regretful latenight postings, so I'll get this out and then watch until tomorrow (I hope).

I'll give you a perfect example of annoying DRM.  I bought DCS Blackshark via online download back when Jarhead was pimping it like crazy. And, I flew it alot and I loved it and all that.

Then I had that horrible virus-inspired computer crash that led to a semi-reinstall of my OS, a FUBAR of my registry, etc.

Now, WRT Blackshark, I no longer have a registry entry for it, and the sim won't play right now.  And, since the registry is fubard, I can't uninstall it.  So, I'm left with the option of deleting it and reinstalling it...without the uninstall.

The DRM gives you 8 installs and 10 uninstalls.  Since I can't uninstall, I have to burn an install...so now I'm down to 6 installs after a few months and I haven't done anything more than have a computer mess up.

Not a big huge deal, but to be honest, I have no idea where I downloaded from, what my "codes" are, what email addy I used, etc etc etc.  I hope I figure it out.  Maybe I won't and I won't even have the $50 drink coaster...I'll have a digital drink coaster I suppose. 

This is the shit that bugs me.  I went against my own DRM principles to get this stupid game, and now I don't even know how to get it back.  And who knows how I'll fare 5 years from now when I eventually get a new computer or two.

This DRM stuff has to stop, and it has to stop now.  I'm not going to do it anymore.  Screw em and screw me.  We both lose.  Because there are games out there I so want to play, but I'm just not doing this anymore.  I made my exception for Blackshark and I'm not doing it again for this exact reason. 

I really want to see First Flight fail.  I do.  It's mean and spiteful, but I no longer care.  If you spend all that energy to build a sim, you can go the last 2 yards to create a manageable and sensible DRM scheme.  Hell, hire Ghostryder to do it.  The guy knows his shit about DRM and he could probably use the business.  I mean, how hard is this anyway?

See, I'm getting all fired up now!  No more posting for me tonight.  Jack Daniels instead!

Woot!!!11!!

Hmm...sounds like there could be a good business model for creating a secure, internet based, personal databank service that stores all of your DRM, password and personal details for computer and console games...

Said service would not only track your passcodes, license keys, email addresses, usernames, passwords, etc, but would also validate said resources on your behalf.  May not solve the whole DRM thing in toto, but might make it easier to reinstall after system crash.  I currently have Mount and Blade and Settlers of Cataan installed on a computer that I want to reformat, but I don't know how to back-up the paid licenses that will allow me to do so.

Jack Nastyface

Has anyone considered that the 'single player' game in this game isn't really single player - in fact I'd argue there is no single player mode unless you can somehow opt out of the stat tracking.  Every time you fly your stats are going to be recorded and other players can measure their performance against yours.

Thusly inherently as a strictly multi-player game, it requires consistant internet connectivity.

*ducks out of the way from incoming projectiles - yes I realize that they should have options to fly without the stat tracking - a true single player experience, but who knows, maybe the global stats are an important part of the gameplay experience they are trying to conveigh?

Speaking of funny things happening about going against your better jusgement- I download the ETW demo off steam- and that demo is what I was playing when my system fried- I don't blame the fry on STEAM- it was my PSU getting taxed by the graphics- but after I get my system up and i try to uninstall the damn demo it wants to log into STEAM to do so. WTF! I got to log in to uninstall a demo--now we're talking a special kind of stupid--

Worse i had deleted the steam app because i don't want my firewall ports opened for thier unwanted and unsecure IM they force down your throat- so I reinstall that shitware and discover I can't log in because I forgot my username.  Problem there was "ghostryder" was already taken. So was ghostryder1 or ghostryder12 or whatever- for the life of me I can't remember what the hell number i put after it---

So you go to thier ...ummm....customer support.... in search of your username- which is another nightmare story in itself-- I mean the hoops one has to go threw just to uninstall a damn demo- wasting at least 3 hours of my time. I'd have been better off hacking the damn Demo out by hand and downloading a ETW torrent.

Now I'm not the most buisness savy guy on this forum but jesus you HAVE GOT TO BE a special kind of stupid to want to put paying customers through this mess.

Out of curiousity's sake, would anyone change their mind if a no-internet crack was available?  Would you still support the DRM spewing company by making the initial purchase if you could modify your version to be drm free?  Or is it the just the ethics of releasing software with DRM that you refuse to support?  Also, raise your hand if you stopped using WinXP when monthly 'validation checks' started.

Not sure I'm arguing one side or the other here, just want to see where everyone stands.  Me, I'd probably pay $20 extra for a DRM free copy.  I suspect they lose far more sales to pirates without DRM than my $20 will cover.

tonnces

This is the shit that bugs me.  I went against my own DRM principles toget this stupid game, and now I don't even know how to get it back. And who knows how I'll fare 5 years from now when I eventually get anew computer or two.

This DRM stuff has to stop, and it hasto stop now.  I'm not going to do it anymore.  Screw em and screw me. We both lose.  Because there are games out there I so want to play, butI'm just not doing this anymore.  I made my exception for Blacksharkand I'm not doing it again for this exact reason. 

I reallywant to see First Flight fail.  I do.  It's mean and spiteful, but I nolonger care.  If you spend all that energy to build a sim, you can gothe last 2 yards to create a manageable and sensible DRM scheme.  Hell,hire Ghostryder to do it.  The guy knows his shit about DRM and hecould probably use the business.  I mean, how hard is this anyway?

See, I'm getting all fired up now!  No more posting for me tonight.  Jack Daniels instead!

Amen Brother! Amen!

Caput


Out of curiousity's sake, would anyone change their mind if a no-internet crack was available?  Would you still support the DRM spewing company by making the initial purchase if you could modify your version to be drm free?  Or is it the just the ethics of releasing software with DRM that you refuse to support?  Also, raise your hand if you stopped using WinXP when monthly 'validation checks' started.

Not sure I'm arguing one side or the other here, just want to see where everyone stands.  Me, I'd probably pay $20 extra for a DRM free copy.  I suspect they lose far more sales to pirates without DRM than my $20 will cover.

In answer to your question, no, I would not pay extra for a DRM free copy.  I would wait until it came out DRM free, say on Gamersgate or Direct2drive.  If that didn't happen, oh well.

I am personally willing to put up with a lot compared to others when it comes to the whole DRM thing.  I don't mind Steam, as I just play in offline mode once I download it.  But this game is over the top.  

As for the lost sales effect of a gamer not having DRM, heres a link to a post by Brad Wardell (aka Frogboy) in regards to DRM and the release of DemiGod.

http://forums.demigodthegame.com/349758/page/2/

"Fate rarely calls upon us at a moment of our choosing." 

-Optimus Prime

I wouldn't pay extra for a DRM free title...Id's expect a substantial discount for having to put up with it. in fact They'd have to give me the game and pay me to play it-- got too many things on my box to open all the holes the DRM would bring in my security.

That's a trick question anyway. First Sale Doctrine rights and moral buisness behavior say it shouldn't be there period. I bought it. I own it. I shouldn't have to do a damn thing regarding the seller after I purchased it- same as if i bought a book or a music CD.

As for "monthly " windows checks- that's easily disabled. Saying that if I wasn't developing a windows title I wouldn't have it on my system. I perfer linux.

As for the idea they'll lose sales if they remove it I totally disagree. They lose sales because it's there and I have yet seen any DRM title not available on the torrents or warez sites- it's serving no purpose other than pissing people off.